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Mornetta



Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:13 am    Post subject: DPS - needs work Reply with quote

To start us out:

( Pawn: v1: "DPS": CritRating=1, Agility=1, HasteRating=1, YellowSocket=15, IsPolearm=0.5, ArmorPenetration=0.5, RedSocket=15, Dps=1, Strength=2, MetaSocket=30, Ap=1, IsSword=0.5, HitRating=2, BlueSocket=15, AxeRating=0.1, ExpertiseRating=0.5, IsAxe=0.5, 2HAxeRating=0.5 )

I just grabbed a DPS spec and made some very slight modifications to it. I know that Agi is too high right now, but wanted to get something out there for people to use as a base.
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lachian



Joined: 16 Nov 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I made this scale based off of the Death Knight DPS Compendium off the Elitist Jerks Forum (http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t36303-dps_compendium/) :

( Pawn: v1: "DK DPS": ArmorPenetration=0.5447, CritRating=1.124, Dps=7.567, Strength=2.4847, ExpertiseRating=1.3914, HitRating=2.4748, HasteRating=0.6214, Ap=1 )

It's missing socket values and probably other things as well, so if you can improve upon this, please post it here.
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MuteTiefling



Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Based on the Elitist Jerks forum above:

Unholy Spec: 17/0/54

Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DK Unholy": ArmorPenetration=0.5447, CritRating=1.124, Dps=7.567, Strength=2.4847, ExpertiseRating=1.3914, HitRating=2.4748, HasteRating=0.6214, Ap=1, RedSocket=29.8164, YellowSocket=29.757 )


Blood Spec: 51/13/7

Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DK Blood": ArmorPenetration=1.0456, CritRating=1.1453, Dps=8.9665, Strength=2.5570, ExpertiseRating=1.7023, HitRating=2.6609, HasteRating=0.5640, Ap=1, RedSocket=30.684, YellowSocket=31.3074 )


Frost Spec: 17/54/0

Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DK Frost": ArmorPenetration=0.7628, CritRating=1.1894, Dps=10.3610, Strength=2.3650, ExpertiseRating=1.2453, HitRating=2.4046, HasteRating=0.4978, Ap=1, RedSocket=28.38, YellowSocket=28.6176 )


All gems are currently assuming Green quality gems from Northrend. 12 Str for Red Sockets and 6 Str/6 Hit for Yellow Sockets.

Also, I've left out Agi for two reasons. First, it's crit does not effect our spells. Second, there is agi present on exactly 23 pieces of plate in Northrend. It's a junk stat and should be avoided. If I had to rate it off of the top of my head I'd put it below haste... but that has no hard math behind it. But, since it's on so little plate, I think it's easily avoided anyway.
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Lojan



Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MuteTiefling wrote:
[...]
Blood Spec: 51/13/7

Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DK Blood": ArmorPenetration=1.0456, CritRating=1.1453, Dps=8.9665, Strength=2.5570, ExpertiseRating=1.7023, HitRating=2.6609, HasteRating=0.5640, Ap=1, RedSocket=30.684, YellowSocket=31.3074 )

[...]

Thanks for your work, I appreciate it!

One question though:
According to EJ, 51/13/7-spec includes 5/5 Bladed Armor.
I don't see Armor playing any role in your scales. Do you consider it negligible or did you simply forget?

If I'm not all wrong about the calculations it should be somewhere along this line:

180 armor = 5 AP
36 armor = 1 AP
=>
Code:
Armor=0.028

OK, I admit its not going to turn a green item into a legendary one!
But I sometimes find the decisions between items a very close call and it might just be the final edge for a decision, or won't it? What do you think?

If I'm all wrong, please let me know so I can correct/delete this post.


...oh, btw. please forgive spelling & grammar mistakes, as English is not my native language.

edit:
Coming to think of it, we might as well bring agility back in the game:

1 agility = 2 armor
180 armor = 5 AP
18 agility = 1 AP
=>
Code:
Agility=0.011
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MuteTiefling



Joined: 18 Nov 2008
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd say go ahead and toss those AGI values in. And the Armor one as well if you use Bladed Armor. To be honest, I was kinda wondering why they didn't have Armor factored into their calculations.... and didn't feel like doing it myself ^_^

I would say that the armor could absolutely make a difference though. The agi? ... It seems so negligible and is on so little gear. But it may make a difference. I had forgotten it's effect on Armor though and thus on AP with Bladed Armor. I was originally looking at it strictly from the standpoint of Crit... Which if I understand correctly crit from AGI still does not effect spell criticals.
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wowplayer69



Joined: 28 Nov 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 9:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Lojan"]
MuteTiefling wrote:


1 agility = 2 armor
180 armor = 5 AP
18 agility = 1 AP
=>
Code:
Agility=0.011


Unless I'm mistaken, this value is incorrect. It is a correct calculation of Agility's contribution to armor and thus Bladed Armor, but it omits the value of Agility on crit.

If my math is right:

Code:
Agility=0.863
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Pestilennce



Joined: 30 Nov 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="wowplayer69"]
Lojan wrote:
MuteTiefling wrote:


1 agility = 2 armor
180 armor = 5 AP
18 agility = 1 AP
=>
Code:
Agility=0.011


Unless I'm mistaken, this value is incorrect. It is a correct calculation of Agility's contribution to armor and thus Bladed Armor, but it omits the value of Agility on crit.

If my math is right:

Code:
Agility=0.863


Your math is solid, only problem is we don't get spell crit added from Agility whereas we do get it from crit rating.
http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t36303-dps_compendium/
Above link has a ton of valuable information for itemizing a Death Knight.
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Nighe



Joined: 12 Dec 2008
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agility should be included. Even if it's not that valuable, it's not negligible either. If Agi affected spell crits too, it should be:

1 Agi ~ 0.8810 (Unholy) or 0.8967 (Blood) or 0.9290 (Frost).

But since it doesn't affect spell crit, I'm going with one of my Naxx parses: 70% of all damage done by me in boss fights was affected by crit from Agi, so that's AGI = 0.65 for Frost.


Blue gems should be included too, either as 6 Str for green quality gems or 16 Atk for blue quality gems (no Str in the game yet).


As for Meta gems, I'm not sure. Using a Chaotic Skyflare Diamond, that's

21 * CritRating + (3% more crit damage). I'm assuming that 3% more crit damage equals 1% more overall damage equals 1% more crit equals 45 crit rating... Yeah, I know, that doesn't sound very accurate. If anyone has a better idea, I'm eager to hear it. Anyway, that's about 70 for Meta gems.


Expertise from weapons. Last but not least one should not forget racials. Orcs, Humans and Dwarves I think get expertise from certain weapons. As a human that's

3 expertise = 98.4 expertise rating
98.4 * PawnExpRating = 122.5 for Swords or Maces as Frost spec.


So, as a Human Frost DPS Deathknight with blue quality gems these are the values I'm using:

Not hit-capped:
Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DPS Frost": IsMace=122.5, CritRating=1.1894, Agility=0.65, ExpertiseRating=1.2453, Armor=0.02778, ArmorPenetration=0.7628, RedSocket=38, Dps=10.361, Strength=2.365, IsSword=122.5, MetaSocket=70, HitRating=2.4046, BlueSocket=16, ColorlessSocket=38, YellowSocket=38, HasteRating=0.4978, Ap=1 )


Hit-capped:
Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DPS Frost NoHit": ArmorPenetration=0.7628, RedSocket=38, IsSword=122.5, IsMace=122.5, CritRating=1.1894, Dps=10.361, ColorlessSocket=38, MetaSocket=70, HasteRating=0.4978, Agility=0.65, ExpertiseRating=1.2453, BlueSocket=16, YellowSocket=26, Strength=2.365, Armor=0.02778, Ap=1 )
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Nighe



Joined: 12 Dec 2008
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

methods posted new values for different specs, which makes my list obsolete.

http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t37087-unholy_dps_discussion/p25/#post1017516
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vexis58



Joined: 22 Feb 2009
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What kind of weight scale would be best for a dual-wield 0/33/38 build? I've been trying to find one, but all I can find are weights for the three full specs.
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Vordak



Joined: 13 Aug 2008
Posts: 33

PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2009 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Based off of what is considered BiS for a unholy dps DK. most of the "0.01" values are just there so it's not absolute 0 value.

Code:
( Pawn: v1: "DeathKnight: Dps (3)": ResilienceRating=0.01, Agility=0.19, ExpertiseRating=0.15, YellowSocket=7.4, ArmorPenetration=0.31, MainHandDps=0.1, Strength=1.37, MetaSocket=45.2, Hp5=1, Ap=0.65, SpeedBaseline=1.5, CritRating=1.85, IsCloth=-9999, ParryRating=0.01, HasteRating=0.43, DefenseRating=0.01, TwoHandDps=0.1, Stamina=0.94, MeleeSpeed=-1, HitRating=0.6, RedSocket=7.8, IsWand=-9999, Armor=0.04, IsMail=-9999, IsLeather=-9999, OneHandDps=0.1, DodgeRating=0.01, BlueSocket=16.9, IsShield=-9999)
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fostot



Joined: 08 Jul 2009
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do we have a pawn scale for 51/0/20 which is the current most popular Blood Spec?
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Mornetta



Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

vexis58 wrote:
What kind of weight scale would be best for a dual-wield 0/33/38 build? I've been trying to find one, but all I can find are weights for the three full specs.


This is a scale based off the work from EJ on stat weight. They are based off the 18/53 Dual Wield build for Runic power generation.

( Pawn: v1: "DW": ArmorPenetration=0.84, CritRating=1.21, Dps=6.36, Strength=3.06, Agility=0.54, HasteRating=1.24, ExpertiseRating=1.18, HitRating=1.15, Ap=1 )

The stat weights are a work in progress.
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