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bando



Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Garona-US

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:16 pm    Post subject: Working on Enhancer scale Reply with quote

Currently I'm trying to compile a rating for Enhancement Shamans. It's not yet finshed but I wanted to share the work so far to get some feedback. All is based on a Level 70 Shaman.

The main attributes crit rating and agi are not yet rated. I know this are the most important however getting them in context is proving quite difficult considering the effect of talents and skills. So let's forget about Agi and Crit Rating for the moment.

The baseline from where I measure all values is DPS:

1 DPS = 1

As 14 AP equals 1 DPS this leads to 1 / 14 Rating per AP

1 AP = 0.07

Strength results into 2 AP per point, meaning 7 Strength = 14 AP = 1 DPS. 1 / 7 Rating per Strength:

1 STR = 0.14

To measure the impact of INT, Spellpower, etc. I use an unskilled Earthshock as a baseline:

Earth Shock
535 Mana
658 - 692 Nature Dmg => 675 Dmg avg
6 sec. CD

Imaging spamming Earthshock in a fight this would mean 675 Dmg average / 6 Sec CD => 112.5 DPS

Considering the mana needed for one Earth Shock: 535 / 112.5 = 4.76 Mana per DPS

So this is another baseline found. Let's take a look at the next ratings:

INT results into 15 Mana. I do not rate the spell crit effect of int as it is way to low to make an impact. However the more Int I have the more mana I got and theoretically the more Earth Strikes I can do until OOM:

1 INT = 15 Mana => 15 Mana / 4.76 Mana per DPS = 3.15 DPS

So the resulting rating for INT would be 1 INT = 3.15

This also make it easy to get a rating for flat mana (from enchants an the like):

1 Mana = 1 Mana / 4.76 Mana per DPS = 0.21 Rating

Now MP5 is a bit tricky. I have to figure out how much mana MP5 really gives during a fight. Generelly spoke the formula for the rating would look something like:

15 MP5 = 15 Mana regained in 5 Secs
15 Mana = 3.15 DPS

but I need 5 seconds to get that mana however the CD is higher so I take that flat. So the rating would be: 3.15 / 15

1 MP5 = 0.21 Rating

Spirit means 1/5 Mana gained per Spirit per Tick. One tick is 2 Seconds so to compare it to MP5 we'd need to multiply by 2.5. So this would be 1/5 * 2.5 Mana gained per Spirit in 5 Seconds. So 1 Spirit is equal to 0.5 MP5:

1 Spirit = 0.42 Rating

I know that there's a huge issue regarding mana reg in fight which is what would count. There's some more research to do on this one for me. As far as I understand MP5 > Spirit even if the above rating would count it differently.

Now Spelldmg is quite a pain to rate from an enhancer point of view. I need to figure out how much 1 point of spell dmg raises the dmg of Earth Shock. Let's imagine it would be 0.5 extra dmg per point of spelldmg:

Spelldmg x 0.5 + dmg Earth Shock = new avg. dmg of Earthshock

Assuming 10 Spelldmg => 10x0.5 = 5 extra dmg / 6 secs CD = 0.83 DPS

So the rating in this case would be 0.83 / 10 = .083 Rating.

I'll dig out the real factor of spelldmg and correct this tonight.


One percent of Spell Crit would leat to one out of 100 Earth Shocks to be critical thus doing 1.5x the dmg:

675 * 99 + 675 * 1.5 - 675 * 100 = 337.5 Extra dmg
3.375 extra dmg avg. / 6 Secs CD = 0.56 DPS

1% Spell Crit = 0.56 Rating

For 1% of Spellcrit on level 70 22.1 Spellcrit Rating are needed. So the pawn rating per point of spell crit rating would be: 0.56 / 22.1

1 Spell crit rating = 0.025 Rating.



In addition to the above I need to get the rating done for values like HP, armor etc. Personally I rate 10 HP = 1 DPS so my baseline for this is:

1 STAM = 1 Rating

Considering flat HP enchantments of course the according rating would be 1 STAM = 10 HP so 1 / 10

1 Health = 0.1 Rating

I'm working on armor from the damage reduction point of view. Hoever I find it quite difficult to find a decent rating there. I'll update this as soon as I have a proper rating for this.


Cheers
Dorobo
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bando



Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Garona-US

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmmm...
i'm not sure...

you reduce all stats to "dps". i thinks, thats the wrong way. because some stats are more worth than its resulting DPS. and like you said: health, armor and manareg would not result directly in DPS...

and you calculate everything on the theory, that you could spam a spell until OOM. well, this *should* never happen ^^ most of the mobs die long before you're OOM.



best would be to get rid of this DPS-calculation. just start at a certain value (maybe SPELLDAM), and balance everything on that.
you easily could check ingame your "new" values by comparing some items.
the final goal should be a set of values wich gives you a balanced number


the other way would be a shrinked pattern, for DPS ONLY! (no manareg, no health, no armor and int only for crit-rate)



i made the same way on MAGE-values. (a total set for endgame-content and a damage-only set)
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bando



Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Garona-US

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the feedback. As an enhancement shaman I'd say the main attributes are everything that boost melee dmg and increases the survivability. So I'd say DPS needs to be configured on it's own and brought in relation to survivability e.g. dodge, hp, armor. That I'm putting quite some thought into how much survivability I would sacrifice in order to boost dps.

Regarding INT, Spelldmg etc. these values relate only to putting totems on the group, using shocks and emergency healing. However yeah you're right these can hardly be translated into dps and I should do some rethinknig there.

Cheers
D
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bando



Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Garona-US

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think you should read this post on the elitist jerks forum as most ppl there know what they are talking about and the post is about this subject aswell


http://elitistjerks.com/showthread.php?t=10086
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bando



Joined: 09 Jul 2007
Posts: 76
Location: Garona-US

PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hu, anyone has a Pawn string for this? ^^ No, I'm not lazy, but better to have a string. Not the first time I busted my ratings because I wrote something wrong. ^^
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Debuff



Joined: 20 Jul 2007
Posts: 4

PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2007 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is taken from the EJ thread about Enh item weights. They came up with another one that was very similar, too.

Code:
/pawn import ( Pawn: v1: "Item Value": RedSocket=17.6, CritRating=1.51, Strength=2.2, MetaSocket=24, Agility=1.47, HitRating=1.08, BlueSocket=17.6, YellowSocket=17.6, Ap=1 )
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Fearlezz



Joined: 22 Sep 2007
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sat Sep 22, 2007 5:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is everything you want to know how stats affect an enhc shammy:

http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t13297-enhance_shaman_collected_works_theorycraft_vol_i/


Quote:
Strength = 2 (2.2 w/Kings)
Crit Rating = 2
Agility = 1.8 (2 w/Kings)
Hit Rating = 1.4
Attack Power = 1
Armor Penetration = 0.25 (low estimate)


Quote:
Up until 1.5 weapon speed, the completed attack power equivalences are:
Haste Rating = 2.2 (Worth 1.48 in 2.2 due to changes in haste rating on the PTR)
Strength = 2 (2.2 w/Kings)
Crit Rating = 2
Agility = 1.8 (2 w/Kings)
Hit Rating = 1.4
Attack Power = 1

Beneath 1.5 weapon speed, haste rating will drop in its average value per point.



Quote:
Itemization - Hit Rating
Current theory is holding that we may not need anywhere near the hit cap like we previously thought. A good explanation of why can be found here. Effectively, because we can get a large quantity of +Hit from talents (9%), our special attacks (windfury and stormstrike) are already hit capped. All the extra +Hit rating on your gear is going toward improving white damage only, which typically comprises between 45%-50% of your total damage. When you consider the itemization costs of hit rating compared to crit rating and AP which directly impact 90% of a shaman's total damage, you can see why hit rating is given lower precedence.

Itemization - Intellect and Mana/5
Intellect on gear is not a significant source of DPS contribution. Pater has a short writeup exploring this here - Enhance Shaman: The Collected Works of Theorycraft, Vol I
Mp5 is almost universally agreed to be a hunter stat that is wasted on enhance shaman gear. Note that the more you decide to contribute in a "hybrid" manner (healing to top off yourself and others) the mana pool will become slightly more important, but not such that you should sacrifice significant DPS upgrades to hold on to 15 Int on another item. The combination of Judgment of Wisdom (you are using JoW right?) and Shamanistic Rage (use it early, use it often) should prevent you from running out of mana even in full rogue leather gear - unless you're having to spot heal.

Itemization Using Stat Weights
First, you must make a decision whether or not to assume that you will have Blessing of Kings. As a general rule, Salvation and Might are superior buffs, so you can only expect Kings in a 25-man scenario. In this example, were comparing 25-man gear, so well assume Blessing of Kings is active. Then, its a simple matter of looking at the stats available on each item, multiplying them by their attack power equivalence, and adding them all up:

[Valestalker Girdle]
+27 Agility (x 2 = 54)
+25 Stamina
+18 Intellect
Equip: Improves haste rating by 36 (x 1.4 = 50.4)
Equip: Increases attack power by 76 (x 1 = 76)
Total: 180.4 AEP

[Girdle of the Tidal Call]
+35 Strength (x 2.2 = 77)
+30 Stamina
+20 Intellect
Equip: Improves critical strike rating by 33 (x 2 = 66)
Total: 143 AEP
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midnightlynx



Joined: 11 Jan 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FWIW, I found the following enhance scale elsewhere on the internet. I don't play a shaman so I can't speak for the relevance, but more input never hurts.

Strength=1
Stamina=1
Intelligence=1
Attack Power=2
Agility=2
Melee Crit=.1
Dodge=.1
Spell Crit=.2
Spell Hit=.2
Defense=5
Parry=.2
hit=.133
Armor=50
Spell Damage=10
Resistance=4
Mana/5 sec=5
HP/5 Sec=5
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